Ive recently come across a dish called Phaal. Im surprised ive never heard of it either when I was in England or here in Australia. Ive not seen it in any restaurant. Is it new? - even though the link says it originates from south India. Im more inclined to think its a British invention? Appears to be just a hotter version of a vindaloo.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phaal

Any comments, thoughts, tried it?

Cheers

Steve

I have never understood the desire of some British restaurants to serve ever increasingly hot curries and people's desire to prove themselves on such curries!

Following difinitions of Phall is from this site; http://flatproduct.co.uk/indiaorganics/menu/main_course.html

"This is an extremely fiery dish of 17 types of fresh & dried chilli peppers including the notorious naga & lanka varieties of Megalaya and Orissa. The curry is laced with hot mustard and paprika oils. This unbelievably hot curry is traditionally served in England with ridiculous amounts of chilled lager during male bonding sessions"

Now who would go to the trouble of collecting 17 types of chillies in their kitchen?

I have not heard of it in India, may be it does exist here somewhere, may be Western India, Bengal or Bihar, who knows! May be it is a British invention, just like Tikka masala. Looking at the recipes, it is simply a curry, to which a lot of chillies have been added.

Incidentally, in Hindi, the word Phal means fruit, so it is not a Hindi name.

Let's see what others think.

Mamta

I must admit, I really enjoy a hot curry from time to time ? usually if I'm suffering from cold or flu. I have a recipe for a phal and I've made it a few times. I have a box of fresh Dorset Naga chillies in the freezer and I use them from time to time, however, they're not for everyone due to their hotness ? and nor do I think they belong in Indian food due to their fruity flavour, they're best in Mexican and caribbean food I think.

I think Mamta has 'put it in a nut-shell'; hot curries tend to be a macho thing and there's a limit to what anyone can eat. I like hot food, but I also think some people use stupid amounts of chilli. I think those dishes are best left for those who have something to prove!

According to the book that contains the phal recipe, it was invented in the UK. Another hot curry that became popular reently is the Bollywood burner. From what I've seen it just looks like a plate of stuffed naga chillies in curry sauce.

Man eats a raw Dorset Naga: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NR7jvw9W-TQ

Sun Newspaper man eats Bollywood burner: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxE3U8-nUB0

This reminds me of that great "Goodness Gracious Me" sketch where the Indian friends go to an English restaurant and want to order the "blandest things on the menu!"

In Brick Lane you regularly see groups of City workers demanding the "hottest vindaloo" - to me a vindaloo should be a very delicate dish. I agree with John if you are are feeling under the weather a Madras with a big chilli kick does the trick to pick you up.

If you want to destroy your taste buds then munch your way through a bowl of Scotch Bonnets, don't bother to cook a curry with too much chilli, instead of giving a warmth to the dish as it will annihilate the taste of all the other ingredients.

could part of the reason people go for increasingly hot curries be down to the addictive buzz qualities of chillies and getting used to it?

Steve

Thats all very interesting, thanks for your replies. I do think these restaurants that serve it pander to the male ego when they are out with their mates (who are all usually a few sheets to the wind). I reckon its all a marketing ploy so the diners can impress their friends when they get a certifcate saying they have eaten the sacred Phaal so the word gets around and everyone dares everyone to try it. What a lot of crap I reckon. Simple things for simple minds I say. I knew it must have been a british/american invention. I must admit though the recipes ive found on the internet are fairly tame compared to what I do to Mamtas vindaloo.

Like ive said before in a couple of my Mamtas vindaloo threads I treat myself every now and then, on a Sunday when my wife and boys go to our family dinner I treat myself and stay home to relax, have a beer and cook Mamtas vindaloo. I usually double the amount of dried chillies and peppercorns (I havent seen any mention of peppercorns in any of the phaal recipes) and sit at home and prepare a dish for myself, which I eat by myself and thoroughly enjoy it. Its very hot, but beautiful and I have no-one to prove it too (if you know what I mean)?) I could still do with mastering my indian breads though. The last lot were like eating play-doh! :o)

Cheers

Steve

P.S. I grow lots of variaties of chillies and wouldnt dream of putting anything else in one of my dishes except green or fresh/dried red chillies. All my others go into the chilli sauces that I make :o)

I've not been able to trace a phall to India either. A conclusion might be its a response by so-called Indian restaurants to satisfy their customers' wants.

I had a phall once, just to satisfy my curiosity. It appeared to be just chilli powder and oil!.

I love chillies and use them all the time (I can get them (mostly from Africa!) fresh from London markets) but I wouldn't just add them to a dish, unless called for, but I like following recipes carefully.

On the subject of Phall- I once heard (and I dont know if this is an "urban myth") that in the early days of Indian restaurants in the UK,they got so fed up of lager louts who had come in for a curry after the pubs shut, and would always be boisterous and demanding an " extra hot" curry that they invented Phall which I was told was a derivative of to Hindi word meaning "bottom burner" ! lol I'd love to know if any one else has heard of this story

Phall is not 'bottom burner' in Hindi, but could mean this in some other Indian language, perhaps Bengali?

MY Hindi to English Oxford dictionary says Phal is;

a ploughshare

a pice, cut or split off

a flake of betel nut

a step, a leap or pace

Fruit in Hindi is called phal, pronounced as phul, as in cull. Goodness knows where this dish's name comes from, though I can well believe the origin of hot curries for lager louts!

Hope this helps.

Mamta

This website is suggesting the Phaal is actually a South Indian curry - http://www.curryaddicts.co.uk/phaal.php It also mentions the "tindaloo" which is supposed to be hotter still !

But I'm rather more inclined to think this website has a better handle on it ! - http://www.allwords.com/word-phal.html LOL

Steve

I'm sure phal and tindaloo are purely 'Indian restaurant' dishes, nothing to do with Indian cuisine, nothing at all to do with eating, in my book!

If you want something really hot, try a chilli pickle. One billion Indians can't be wrong!

I will agree with Lapis. I think some Indian restaurants give some silly name to some silly dishes, pulled out of a restautrant chef's hat! I have never heard of Tindaloo. I don't think it is a word in any Indian language, just a made up one. It sounds like a joined up word; tinda + aloo (tinda gourd + potato), which obviously has nothing to do with this dish!

Did you not check the second link in my post?.. its says its a made up thing to cope with the "I'm well ard I can eat molten lead" types... (or something along that line... lol

I too think they are just a normal curry/vindaloo with a heap of extra chillies/chilli powder/ginger/peppercorns thrown in to make them insanely hot just so some people can challange each other etc..

Steve

I saw both the links Steve. I am sure the 'definition' was written after the silly invention, and nothing to do with any actual word.

Mamta

Well, forget your B/T/Vindaloo or your phal, check this recipe out: http://www.curryfrenzy.com/curry/recipes/Chicken-Naga-the-Worlds-Hottest-Curry.html

I don't know if the website owner has made that recipe up or if it's from elsewhere, but 24 naga chilies? I mean, come on, that's just ridiculous - surely there should be a disclaimer to go with that recipe :-)

I like naga chilies but I wouldn't dream of eating 24 or them in a curry.

This is crazy and ---24 of the hottest chillies ? But why 24 ? why not 30 or 41 ?. No point in producing a curry which cannot possibly be consumed. This would put even the Naga naga (king cobra) to shame.

I think this is just a silly recipe, I hope no one is stupid enough to try it. God help their digeStive tract if they do!

My brother who like his curries hot and over the years has probably got slightly hotter and hotter made himself a curry with normal strength chilies and put 6 in. That is too hot for me as it just burns (and last time I had one of his it burned for days with a sort throat!). Putting 24 chilies, never mind 24 Naga chilies in a curry is no longer cooking or food !

Steve

I must admit, I do like naga chilies, but the most I've ever put in one curry is two. That was a bit much so the most I ever use now is one. I'm limited to the amount of times I can use them because I normally cook for other people.

I agree that using 24 nagas is stupid, but in my experience once the chili cheat reaches a certain level I don't think it goes beyond that, well not for me anyway. However, it's what's going on inside.

The nagas are very very potent and, well, a few hours after eating them my urine is so hot that I re-live the whole experience all over again ... and in the morning ... well ... another story!

I only eat about ten nagas a year.

If your body isn't used to eating nagas or other very hot peppers, or if you ate too many, could it cause your central nervous system to go haywire, or possible pack up all together?

It is said that you get addicted to eating to chiilies. This appears to be true, if you see families where even small children start eating hot food, because that is how it is cooked in their house. They then don't enjoy mild food. Is it because their taste buds are destroyed or is it because they become addicted to the adrenaline rush? Who knows!

See; http://www.worldofchillies.com/chilli_facts/chillifacts.html and scroll down to Capsaicin - What makes chillies hot

Is chilli good, is chilli bad? Tehse are interesting;

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T6P-3VXHG4M-B&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=df33a6beb48276cd956248f0881d27c4

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T99-3YYTFV1-37&_user=10&_origUdi=B6T6P-3VXHG4M-B&_fmt=high&_coverDate=04%2F21%2F1995&_rdoc=1&_orig=article&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=4d89f99c08400986cb8c3192021432c2

Moderation is the key in chillies I guess. Anyway next year I have decided to grow Nagas in my temporary green house.

I'm not sure that ingesting chillies (once past the mouth/throat) has any harmful effects on the internal organs. The reason for their hotness is due to a group of conpounds collectively known as capsaicinoids, and number six or more, although each one has a different degree of 'hotness, the most potent (capsaicin) being equivalent to 16,000,0000 on the Scoville scale.

Capsaicin can be said to be a member of the vanillin family (yes, the main component of vanilla flavour)and includes compounds found in hot ginger.

In the mouth and other sensitve (to "burning") areas of the body, there are receptors which undergo change when presented with a vaniiloid type compound. Rather boringly, it is called the vanillin receptor (or VR1). When capsaicin (or other compounds, but not, surprisingly vanillin itself) is captured by the receptor, a channel opens which lets calcium ions in. This in turn sends signals to the brain telling us we are being burnt, which we aren't of course. It is just the sensation of burning, and no damage is caused.

Again, surprisingly, one of the 'cures' for 'burning' in the mouth by chillies is milk or yoghurt, both of which contain calcium. I think the only relief one gets is from their coldness. A much better remedy, I have found, is pure sugar. I don't know why, but even sugar substitute works well!

to be fair..the hotness of the phal or vindaloo or naga chicken varies from restaurant to restaurant ..i have had immensely fruity phal curries that were not that hot, then i have had phals that are basically "toilet paper in the fridge" and don't have much flavor at all .....i will keep on trying these dishes from different restaurants just to find the perfect balance between heat and fruitiness ...good eating

to be fair, these dishes have no resemblance to pukka Indian food, as discussed on this forum, and the food in most 'Indian restaurants' are 'Indian' in name only.