Having read recipes on here, seen some done on tv and done my usual researching from anything I have....

I've had several attempts to make chicken Korma, which as far as it goes isn't the cream and banana filled mush you get from takeaways !...

Korma as far as I've read is about being thickened by ground almond and coconut milk ?

So my recipe allowed for onion, chillies, spices and then about 2-3 good tablespoons of ground almond powder, a full tin of coconut milk and some fresh corriander all then topped off with some flaked almonds...

Flavour comes out well, looks good but for want of a better word its very "claggy".

Claggy - sticks in your throat, a bit like eating pva glue might be....

is this down to the almond paste ? Am I using too much ?

Steve

Mum's recipe uses quite a lot of ground nuts too so I wouldn't imagine that would be the reason but then again, kormas do have quite a grainy sauce rather than a silky smooth one?

Steve,

put out of your mind the restaurnt variety.

Korma (it's origin is really unknown, though probably of Moghal influence and therefore more North than South Indian, so no coconut/bananas)is really a braising dish, or dishes. To braise meat (and the meat should be on the bone and in one piece) it should be placed in a sealable pan with water and fat/ghee so that the liquid only comes half way up the joint (or whole chicken, if using). It is cooked in a low temperature oven (say 120 - 140 ?C). The fat and moisture come from the meat and added yoghurt/cream/milk, the pot is usually sealed with a ribbon of dough, so the meat is cooked 'on dum'.

There are many forms of korma, not all of them mild, not many contain nuts. Examples of kormas include rogan josh, shab deg, rezalas and dopiazas. Kashmiri cooking has many kinds, and so it is not unreasonable to infer that they may have originated by the people of this region, or those passing through it. Kormas are usually made from mutton (goat) but in more resent times, chicken has been used.

As we journey south in India, the korma becomes modified to become little more than a pale reflection of the original; ie nuts and coconut(and its 'milk')are added. This is the kind most often found in 'Indian restaurants'.

so it appears even the idea I have isn't the correct one either !.....

Still seems a little too thick for pleasant eating though

thanks

Steve

I think many people would be surprised at exactly what was what re Indian cuisine. In the west, our benchmarks for non-Indians would have been 'Indian restaurants' offerings for the most part, a very sorry state of affairs.

I here what you are saying but if you arent indian they were the only available avenue to try Indian dishes as was the case for me. I know they make food to suit the masses of "lager louts" after a night on the town but if it wasnt for these restaurants I wouldnt now be making my own. They are a good introduction I believe.

Cheers

Steve

I hear what you are saying too, the intro for most non-desi-Indians, but hardly a good introduction, I would argue. It sent out all the wrong messages: heavy, oil-laden slop, virtually the same flavours of every dish from the same restaurant, vivid colouring, 'league table of heat ratings', all made with the chefs 'special' herbs and spices. I really don't know how these restaurants have evaded the 'trades description act' for so long.

May I add that I think real Indian cuisine produces the finest food on earth, 'Indian restaurant food' probably one of the worst.

yeah I guess so....but there are some good restaurants. They arent all bad. I remember when I went back to England a few years ago my Dad and step mum took me out to an Indian restaurant and it was terrible compared to the restaurants here. I couldnt eat the main meal as the beef reminded me of small dog food cubes.

Cheers

Steve

Korma curry is not just one special dish, there are many different ways of making it. As I understand it, ?korma? is a term that can be used for any rich curry which is creamy and nutty, it may be mild or hot. There is no fixed recipe for it, everyone makes it differently.

Secondly, what you are all missing here, if you have tried my recipe, is that it is not just a Chicken Korma recipe, it is Navratan or Nine Jewell (nuts) Chicken Korma recipe, containing 9 types of nuts. Therefore, it is a very rich korma curry, perhaps more so than a restaurant one, which may simply be a Creamy Chicken Korma Curry.

Nuts are used rather like thick cream, added at the end. As long as nuts are ground fine, it should be a smooth, creamy sauce, not ?clangy?. Was it ground to a smooth paste? Did it perhaps need a little more water? It is possible you are using too much nut paste?

Though it is rather a rich sauce, with so many nuts in it, you can reduce the amount of nuts to suit your taste. Or use a single variety, like cashew or almonds alone.

As Lapis says, north Indians don?t very often use coconut, because coconut grows mainly in the southern and eastern India.

Indian food has come a long way in UK since the early 70?s, when it was all a rather oily, over spiced, stale affair, almost certain to give you a tummy upset. These days, you can get some really good Indian food in UK, especially in big, cosmopolitan cities. But there are still far too many restaurants serving ?bad? Indian food.

UK Indian food now has it?s own entity, often completely different from the food in India. If you go to India after a long gap, you will find that restaurant and home food there has also changed a lot in recent years. So, don?t get bogged down in names, make your own, experiment, chop and change recipes to suit your palate, have fun.

Mamta :-)

[quote]Korma curry is not just one special dish, there are many different ways of making it. As I understand it, ?korma? is a term that can be used for any rich curry which is creamy and nutty, it may be mild or hot. There is no fixed recipe for it, everyone makes it differently.[/quote]

I would suggest that 'korma' is a technique rather than a dish (or range of dishes), just as bhuno is a technique, although also used to describe a dish/es.

Kormas (Northern Indian ones) are as described above, they are braising dishes, made from lamb/mutton/goat or more recently chicken, left on the bone or carcas, and cooked on dum in a liquid of water/fat which only comes, at most, half way up the meat, so that it can brown. The sealed dish is cooked in a low oven, the pan is shaken several times to allow even browning. The water is provided by the meat itself and yoghurt or cream/milk, or both. No extra liquid is added to the sealed pan.

There are many varieties of korma, such as rogan josh (in its most basic form made with just spices and yoghurt with l/m/g), mirchwagon (chilli) korma, containg more chillies than a vindaloo (if you are counting), dopyaz which is meat braised with onions, etc. Some of the nutty ones are usually labelled 'Shahi' meaning or alluding to 'of the Royal courts'. The group of dishes we call 'korma' is probably the largest group of any.

If the dish is not made using the above mentioned methods, it isn't really a korma.

The navrattan (nine courtiers) were artisans of the court of King Akbar, one of whom was called Dopyaz.

I am sure you are right about the word Korma Lapis. My Muslim friend once told me that Korma simply means a rich curry, any curry.

"The navrattan (nine courtiers) were artisans of the court of King Akbar, one of whom was called Dopyaz."

Navratan/navratna/navratn is actually a combination 2 Hindi words. The word ?nav? meaning ?nine? (nav can also mean ?new? in a different context) and the word ?ratan or ratn? meaning jewel or precious stone. So, ?navratan? simply means nine jewels. It predates Akbar. The courtiers in Akbar?s court were given this title because they were valued by him like his ?jewels?.

Anything that has nine different types of jewels is called navratan. I am sure about this, because navratan jewellery is quite common in north India. I have had a navratan Indian bracelet my mother gave me for my wedding more than 40 years ago. She has also given me her ?navratan. earnings recently. Both have 9 different types of precious stones. See here; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navaratna or http://www.sarnam.com/ninegems.asp.

Lapis, I am not writing this to criticize you, simply saying what the word means. You are a hugely valued contributor here :-). I thought it will be interesting for people to know what navratan actually stands for.

Who would have thought a simple question about my claggy korma would end up with all this info ! lol

Steve

Good isnt it :o)

Cheers

Steve

no criticism felt, Mamta, anyway, from you I would accept it, willingly!

I don't feel we are disagreeing about anything. The Navrattan things I knew about, I sometimes make a 'navrattan biryani' using peppers and nuts as 'jewels'.

I'm also told by my Indian business/gourmet friends that 'navrattan' is also applied to the top nine companies trading in India, (like the FTSE 100 in the UK).

However, I would still suggest that korma means a braising dish, rather than any dish, or creamy nutty dish. In its precise form, a korma uses quite specific techniques, but like in all cuisines, we adapt and adopt, just not too well sometimes!!

A rather belated Happy new year to you and yours, by the way.

Thank you Lapis for the New year greetings.

You may of course be absolutely roght about Korma. I am off to India in 2 weeks, I will try to get a definitive answer on that from some Muslim learned people I know :-)! my access to internet will be very limited, unless I can find an internet cafe, so it may be a while before I get back to you.

Mamta

If you want your korma to taste similar to UK restaurant curry, try adding evaporated milk to it!

It works!

I would have thought the recipes on this forum are way better than anything dished up in an 'Indian restaurant'. Why not try the real thing, Roger, you may like it?